So in a typical 1v1 on these maps, you have 3 choices. You can go ground, you can go air, or you can turtle and get something like a nuke or a loyalty gun or artillery.
Now, I found out that I can almost always counter ground with air. On a small map, I have my first factory be a landfac making tanks, and every other factory is an air factory making a mix of fighters and gunships. This quite neatly counters a ground army, as the gunship pwns land units even with lots of AA, unless the land army is nearly all AA. If that happens I just send in my tanks.
And for the air battles, UEF is vastly superior to the other factions. See the other thread here why, but I JUST came from a ranked game where I discovered this. My opponent and I had the SAME mass scores, and I was Aeon. We both went all air. The entire game the air battles were being fought over my AA towers, and I had the shield and flare upgrades on my weedoboths.
It wasn't even a contest - he massively outspammed me in fighters and then made just enough bombers to kill my acu.
For turtling, UEF is vastly superior to the other factions because they get those fortified artillery which no other factions get a comparable unit to. Also, UEF gets AA on it's mexes and research stations, compensating for their weaker AA towers. The fortified artillery are the best PD in the game, and UEF can't be attacked by air due to their overwhelming advantage in fighters.
On the rare ranked navy map, UEF navy pwns all. Battleships defeat Aeon tanks very easily once they have some upgrades, even with teleport. UEF subs rule the seas because for the same cost they do twice as much torpedo dps as the cybran destroyers.
So it seems like the balance is massively tilted in favor of UEF. Any reason I'm wrong?|||You are wrong for several reasons.
First, UEF mobile and tower AA is the weakest. No other faction can best UEF in air-to-air, but it's not like UEF gets free reign of the skies. Combinations of AA towers and FBs can destroy fighter and land units combinations.
Second, UEF land is better than cybran but considerably worse than Aeon. Aeon land is the strongest and UEF Wasps (interceptors) are great, but useless versus land.
Third, the light artillery is strong but research intensive, mass intensive and power intensive. It takes 6 to unlock them and another 2 to unlock direct first. They cost about 300 mass and 1100 energy to build and 500 each use of the direct fire weapon. It's relatively easy to overwhelm any player using these prior to them getting a critical mass of them that repels all land units into perpetuity. Also, this strategy is weak to Cybran artillery and megaliths and isn't so good against aeon land.|||Habeed|||FunkOff|||If a player goes all air in a 1v1 then they should be stomped. Land rush > air rush in 1v1.
Otherwise, air owns everything in SupCom2. Without flak and with weak mobile AA, it's very easy to blob air and destroy everything or easily snipe the ACU.
So in 1v1 you have to land fac rush and stomp them before they can build any significant amount of bombers. One or two AA towers pushed up with a tank/mml blob will stop anything.
Watch some of Funk's replays, he displays this well.|||Habeed|||Oh yeah OP, you're very, very wrong. You see, UEF has best mid-game out of all factions, best lategame air (due to air forts) and best navy (those always kick ***). Late-game they have not much vs arty spam (aegis spam perhaps? meh)
However, gayeon have best early game, with very crappy mid-game and ok-ish lategame.
Cybran is pretty crappy early, ok mid-game and best lategame.
Also, if he won the air battle without any air forts, and you had flares then you did something very, very wrong.|||Flare weedies wreck wasps on even ground, and can even hold on and keep up for a good amount of time under airfort spam pressure. Either the UEF player had map dominance or you seriously screwed up some air play.
You're wrong, but you're still going along the right idea when you talk about air and ground in 1v1. Originally the metagame reviolved almost entirely around groundspam but air has been favoured more and more as the metagame has evolved. Air first and air second are becoming increasingly popular as there is simply so much you can do with an air factory. However the importance of air depends largely on the map, smaller maps relegate them to sniping outlying mexes and harrassment, while larger maps are won or lost based on your air production.
Cybran gets the most out of drawing the game out, as there are simply so many excellent techs available later into their tree that are both powerful and practical, and their units are so mediocre without them. Aeon is quite the opposite, they have a few very powerful latageame techs, but the emphasis is on few and their options narrow to only a few truly effective tools lategame (and almost nothing worthwhile before them), but their units come out of the starting gate strong and have lots of excellent upgrades available right away to make them even stronger for minimal RP.
UEF have some pretty decent techs all throughout the game, though I would argue their earlygame tree is a little lacking, they do still have strong unupgraded units to help balance it out.
Oh and don't let FArty's get your goat too much. We all lost to FArty cheese at one point or another while we learned the game, they're a very popular scrub tool. But once you get a little better and become a little more solid at the game, dealing with fart cheese becomes easier and you realize that it is, really, just cheese no different from a 4fac shotja rush or a comm rush, and it's actually not difficult to avoid getting farted all over.|||I can just SMELL Z32's last paragraph... Stinky cheese anyone?
|||Perhaps with equal numbers, but here was the scenario :my opponent and I had EQUAL mass.
Both of us had all the factories we could supply spamming air.
He was spamming fighters, I was spamming weedoboths. Before major air battles (I would just run before) I got the flare upgrade.
I selected my group and did "attack move". I was soundly defeated - it wasn't even close.
After I lost, I checked the score to be sure - he did NOT have a mass advantage, nor did he have a research advantage.
The numbers bear this out : he was getting 3 fighters for the price of two. Maybe my fighters were slightly better with the flare upgrade, but sheer numbers meant he won.|||Did he have air forts? They spam out things heaps cheaper than air factories.|||With flares, weedoboths can beat wasps pretty much 2-1 or better.
I hate to tell ya, kid, but things don't work out quite like they do in your head. Take a gander at the replay and see if you can convince yourself that you were just outplayed.|||Watch out for mass elves. They steal your mass and use it make more elves. Legend has it that they prefer to live in mass extractors, although some have been spotted in mass converters.|||You should also check out how many air facts he had, was he assisting each one? If you assist 4 factories each with 1 engineer you can increase your total air production by 33%.
Also, if he had air forts (and sufficient time after he had gotten them) then you will lose. Badly.|||Air micro ftw, 20 wasps beat 20 wasps with 12-14 wasps left if you air micro and your opponent doesnt. Proven to be working.|||Nephylim|||Incidentally, Aeon Tactical Missile structures > Fortified artillery.
Better range, much more accurate against structures, way more damage. It's one of the reasons that aeon can work so well early game.
Mid-Late game they lose most slugfests, but key researches like unit teleport and flares can make matches turn on a dime. So many times have I won games I should've lost from those researches. Remember, you win a game of chess through checkmate and not taking every piece your opponent has. Same applies here.
Furthermore, gunships are a mid-game unlock. Many a player has foolishly teched towards them as their first move and simply been taken down because they've spent all of their RP on something that's easily counterable. If you go gunship, don't show the enemy that you have them until you're able to do some real damage with a suitably sized blob.|||splattedone|||Well at least you're admitting there's a problem now.. Its a step in the right direction I suppose, even if you refuse to do anything about it
|||Wucked|||Manta|||But the point still stands, see an enemy digging in with a load of fortified artillery? Make a factory and put a shield on it just outside of the arty range, then build a load of TML under the shielding. Win.|||Manta|||6RP makes the TML the cheapest option of all of those.|||Manta
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